Topic: FPS Terminator indie game

[pazur]

Just learned about this indie Terminator game. Check it out! It looks great!

http://www.moddb.com/games/fps-terminator

[kat]

That's pretty good for a one man job, though I wonder about it's prospects; did he get permission from the IP/rights holders to do that? I'm surprised that he's not had that thing 'foxed' with the media exposure he's had, a common problem with mucking about with other peoples ideas - modding history is littered with the polygonal carcasses of many a 'stolen' (as the rights holders see it) IP/idea. Good luck to him all the same though.

[pazur]

Yea... I always wondered how other mod makers handle this "copyright" issue.

Like the Back To The Future mod for GTA Vice City: http://www.moddb.com/mods/back-to-the-future-hill-valley or the Star Wars mod for BF2: http://www.moddb.com/mods/star-wars-battlefront-conversion-pack

I bet they have been contacted by the people who really own the rights. Maybe that even has been their intention to get the "foot in the door" in the gaming industry.

[kat]

I doubt James Cameron needs a foot in the door via a modder, lol The guy would have to ask him and Warner Brothers, is that the studio that owns the rights to the Terminator IP now? (according to Wiki it's been released by several different studios over the years so whomever has the rights now would be the ones that need asking I should think). I remember when even simple things like the Aliens player model for Quake 3 was initially pulled, as were a few others.

These things largely just slip in under the door so no-one notices, in this day and age of IP protectionism is difficult to imagine any other scenario, especially on 'active' properties (IP's being actively exploited by studios).

[pazur]

I meant that the modders want to get the "foot in the door" (not James Cameron ) by  releasing such a mod.

BTW: The FPS Terminator looks great but is hardly playable. A nice "tech" demo... although the UTIII engine is nothing new.

[kat]

Yes it's good for one guy, but the truth is.. people like it and think it's cool not because of the work he's done, but it because it's Terminator, a brand they're already familiar with (it's why the industry is so bent on sequels with gamers blaming developers for doing it without realising that they're the ones causing it!). It would be more impressive if they were saying the same things about something completely original (Wilkos Monkeys of Doom springs to mind).

The industry is and always has been looking for originality, they can find hundreds of artists to build stuff, and simply porting someone idea, whilst it shows a good deal of *technical* competency, will have him hired as "just another production artist". I suspect he doesn't want to go down that route.

So, having said all that (and I know I'm preaching to the chior a bit here ), using someone else's ideas are a good way to get to grips with the fundamentals of a given technology without getting overburdened with the 'art' aspect of it. So if that's what he's actually doing here.. a 'tech demo' as you said, then he should be encouraged to expand on what's he's done and apply it to his own ideas, perhaps even to eventually self-publish his own original games.

[carnage]

With a one man team I don't think its even worth worrying that he doesn't own the IP since its almost certain that he doesn't have the resources to turn this into a fully fledged game/mod (maintaining that level of quality throughout).

If he is making a tech demo for the foot in the door idea, I can see the appeal of using an exiting IP. From my point of view I probably have the technical skills required to code/model something similar (given time) but defiantly don't have the artistic skills for imagination/concept or something so striking. So if I was making a tech demo using an established IP to get the visuals appeals to me

[kat]

It's striking because of the psychological associations the viewer already has in their heads from watching the movies and games; the battle scene already exists so it's simply borrowed imagery, a port. Don't get me wrong though, doing this sort of thing is how we've all learnt the craft, but, if you're already competent enough to port that sort of content then you've got the skills to be using that talent to produce your own original content, like yourself and your visual acuity application. Brilliant bit of thinking that. You did exactly what I'm talking about here, rather than do justanotherFPS (JAFPS) porting some idea already in hundreds of other games, you used what skills you had and came up with something new and original based on a simple idea. And it works. Get that out AppStore and target health professionals and you could be onto a winner that has more 'meaning'.

Put it this way... if he were a member here (he won't be now lol!), he would have been encouraged to use his skills to manifest something more original, even if it were to use the 'Terminator' imagery... how about "Terminators in Love" - hot coffee anyone!, "Terminators Tea party" - just who is the mad hatter, "Terminators Day Off" - shenanigans on a day off work; something wacky or an odd take on the franchise.

[carnage]

I see your points. But I mean if I wanted to make say a portfolio piece to show of modelling skills then my problem would be with the idea/concept rather than the actual development skills.

And as in many studios the concept artists and modellers are separate jobs I can see how using existing IP would be a problem. In fact it may be an advantage as it show how you can turn someone else idea into a working model.

I really would love to be able to come up with concepts/ideas but I don't even have an idea where I would begin to learn skills like that

[kat]

I see your points. But I mean if I wanted to make say a portfolio piece to show of modelling skills then my problem would be with the idea/concept rather than the actual development skills.

So using your visual app... would you say the 'idea' or 'concept' was a failure? I'm sure you probably think you could have done better at communicating specific ideas and thoughts with hindsight, but you mustn't make the error in thinking that all ideas and concepts are 'complete' in the literal sense of the word. So long as you have or present enough information for someone to understand what you're wanting to do then you'll have no problems, certainly if you're doing your own projects. If you handing that 'idea' to someone else for refinement, you're more than capable enough to communicate what needs to be done, how it should look etc.. etc.. And this is what's meant when game companies say they want people with broader skills and understanding

And as in many studios the concept artists and modellers are separate jobs I can see how using existing IP would be a problem. In fact it may be an advantage as it show how you can turn someone else idea into a working model.

It gives you a good basis from which to show you grasp the principles, yes. But for the same reason you don't use tutorial material in your 'folio, it doesn't show a true representation of your wider understanding or your skills (see point above)... In other words, it's easier to port something when you have an already existing template in another game/format/medium, coming up with 'new' material is infinitely more tricky (as you hinted above) and reveals a much greater depth to your capabilities as a content author. Using your little app as an example again, I think you may be surprised at just how much more interest you would get because of that versus someone else with a mod port, certainly from anyone that knew their stuff.